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Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:29 pm
by MikeM
Paul wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:16 pm
Who was it who said “statistics, statistics and damned lies....”?
Probably someone near the bottom 😉
There are lots of variations in the many surveys out there but you will rarely find Lexus/Toyota outside of the top 3.

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:50 pm
by Paul
MikeM wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:29 pm
Paul wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 6:16 pm
Who was it who said “statistics, statistics and damned lies....”?
Probably someone near the bottom 😉
There are lots of variations in the many surveys out there but you will rarely find Lexus/Toyota outside of the top 3.
😂
Fair comment, but most surveys are fairly unrepresentative in that only people with a comment to make actually respond...

I have fond memories of an old O level maths teacher giving us this problem to solve ...... I’ve updated the figures but the “statistics” are the same....

“In 2017, 1 in 7 or 13% of all road traffic deaths were cause by drunk driving, therefore 87% of all fatal road traffic accidents were caused by sober drivers...therefore it’s safer to drink and drive....discuss”

Many lols and winks...but a statistic nonetheless!

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:14 am
by Peteski
Pivot wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:57 pm
I am not a fan of Toyota, but they are doing most things right and it shows:
I am somewhat surprised that Audi ranks higher then Porsche [emoji2957]
Lexus = boring, dull, totally uninspiring dross. The fact that they may be reliable is of very little consolation.
Toyota = like Lexus, but cheaper
Mazda = functional, but about as exciting as choosing a dishwasher
Subaru = weird noisy plasticky ugliness
Kia = the sensible budget choice and some interesting ideas
Infiniti = just no!

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:17 am
by Peteski
johnd wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:30 pm
Pivot wrote:
Sat Feb 09, 2019 4:00 pm
Eventually, gubernators will force our hand to buy more EVs, but in the meantime while we can still enjoy “Petrol Therapy” it would be silly not to!
Of course there is EV therapy too (with a suitably powerful EV - I'm not thinking eg Leaf here, more Model S/X, I-Pace, and Taycan I'm sure). It's obviously not the same multi-sense experience but can probably give the semicircular canals more of a workout than many ICE cars that non-super-rich punters are likely to own.
Can't say I'm missing petrol therapy. My 911 hasn't moved a wheel in the last year so it's up for sale in the spring. I'd seriously consider replacing it with a Taycan if I could actually buy one.

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:40 am
by Davidone
Just for interest

My wife has a Toyota LC, bought new in 2006, now covered 287,000 miles..........faults/problems during that time....Zero

Food for thought....

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:47 am
by Rab J
Davidone wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:40 am
Just for interest

My wife has a Toyota LC, bought new in 2006, now covered 287,000 miles..........faults/problems during that time....Zero

Food for thought....
The days of German cars being the most reliable is long gone with the over engineered salons of the 80s. If you want a reliable car these days buy Japanese and make sure it was built in Japan and not something cobbled together in France.

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 10:49 am
by Peteski
Davidone wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:40 am
Just for interest

My wife has a Toyota LC, bought new in 2006, now covered 287,000 miles..........faults/problems during that time....Zero

Food for thought....
There's no doubt that Toyota are kings of reliability, but unfortunately their cars have zero appeal to me beyond that.

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:04 am
by Peteski
Rab J wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:47 am
Davidone wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:40 am
Just for interest

My wife has a Toyota LC, bought new in 2006, now covered 287,000 miles..........faults/problems during that time....Zero

Food for thought....
The days of German cars being the most reliable is long gone with the over engineered salons of the 80s. If you want a reliable car these days buy Japanese and make sure it was built in Japan and not something cobbled together in France.
Good point about being built in Japan. Our British built Nissan is a bit of a dog on build quality and has had plenty of faults in 50k miles. Nothing serious, but it's far from perfection.

German reliability has been fairly average for a while IME. Back in 2002 I bought a brand new BMW 330i thinking it would be pretty solid and that had the worst interior build quality I've ever experienced in any car. Literally every interior panel was rattling or squeaking like crazy, not helped by the terrible harsh crashy ride. It was so bad I couldn't live with it and sold it in less than a year. Of the half dozen or so 911s I've owned over the years, all except one went back to the garage on a flatbed at least once. In fact, as much as I love them, they are the only cars that have ever left me stranded by the roadside! Not even Alfa Romeos have done that to me :lol: IME most mundane Euro-boxes are very unlikely to leave you stranded, regardless of their other niggles.

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:54 pm
by MikeM
Peteski wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 10:49 am
Davidone wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:40 am
Just for interest

My wife has a Toyota LC, bought new in 2006, now covered 287,000 miles..........faults/problems during that time....Zero

Food for thought....
There's no doubt that Toyota are kings of reliability, but unfortunately their cars have zero appeal to me beyond that.
Toyota was called in to advise Porsche at the start of the 1990s, when the German manufacturer was close to collapse. They introduced them to TPS (Toyota Production System) AKA "The Toyota Way" sorting out Porsche's then woeful production methods. The increased quality and efficiencies gained allowed them to turn attention toward new product development, this led firstly to the creation of the Boxster and Cayenne products creation and the rest is history. So if it wasn't for Toyota, Porsche would probably not have survived to become the world most profitable car company ( by unit) and this forum would never have even existed 🤔😉

Re: Macan BEV v Facelift

Posted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:55 am
by FreddyB123
Peteski wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:14 am
Pivot wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:57 pm
I am not a fan of Toyota, but they are doing most things right and it shows:
I am somewhat surprised that Audi ranks higher then Porsche [emoji2957]
Lexus = boring, dull, totally uninspiring dross. The fact that they may be reliable is of very little consolation.
Toyota = like Lexus, but cheaper
Mazda = functional, but about as exciting as choosing a dishwasher
Subaru = weird noisy plasticky ugliness
Kia = the sensible budget choice and some interesting ideas
Infiniti = just no!
Great analysis Peterski!
:D :D :D