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Col Lamb
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Post by Col Lamb »

goron59 wrote: Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:07 pm VAG and others have been working on a coordinated partnership with other providers for charging for ages. They don't (and shouldn't) have to do it themselves.
Very true.

Unfortunately there is not a single standard at present of charging points or even charging cables.

Different connectors are currently:- Type 1, Type 2, Chademo, CCS, Commando, Tesla and the UK standard MK three pin power socket.

So who is going to pay for the installation of public charging stations?

Looking at Zap maps then there are charging stations located at dealers who sell EV, but in practice what use are they to anyone who has an EV since most dealerships are located in out of town Motor Villages. Where I live Audi, Merc, Toyota, Seat, Skoda are all located in a motor city development with Mini, BMW, Jaguar, Fiat, Ford and Volvo are all near the docks and one mile from the City Centre, Nissan are by themselves and a steep uphill walk of 3/4 mile to get to the City Centre.

Is your company going to install charger stations or even allow you to use their 240v sockets to charge your EV whilst you are at work?

Are Supermarkets going to install charging stations so that you can charge whilst you shop.

If EVs are going to have a 300 mile range then will public chargers be required?

How will those EV owners who have no off street parking going to charge their cars?

Too many questions, not enough answers.

Maybe if the BBC cut the gross overpayment of their stars (Evans £2mil per annum which equates to about £5k per hour for his radio show) then they could se the cash saved to install a whole host of charging stations.
Col
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CharlesElliott
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Post by CharlesElliott »

My view

> Is your company going to install charger stations or even allow you to use their 240v> sockets to charge your EV whilst you are at work?

Yes

> Are Supermarkets going to install charging stations so that you can charge whilst you shop.

Yes (already happening). Costco and Morrisons within 5 miles of me already have charging bays.

> If EVs are going to have a 300 mile range then will public chargers be required?

Nowhere near to the extent that people think they will. I expect charging infrastructure to be biased towards destination charging rather than replacing 'filling stations'.

> How will those EV owners who have no off street parking going to charge their cars?

At a public charger. People don't have petrol stations at home.

Charles
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happy days
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Post by happy days »

CharlesElliott wrote: Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:59 am

At a public charger. People don't have petrol stations at home.

Charles

Imagine the fun drunks and small children are going to have unplugging them all... plus imagine the compo claims that will ensue from 'careful' people tripping over all those wires which were just left lying around! Plus I suspect charge rage could be a factor when some people hog the public stands or leave their cars unattended for hours and hours while there is a queue to get to them. A bit like the queue at the petrol station when some people park at the pumps and go in for a full week's shopping or a sit down meal!
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Dandock
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Post by Dandock »

It's interesting to read that Audi, presumably with other parts of the VAG Group, are sharing Porsche's e-Mission platform. One presumes that this arrangement is reciprocal with, for example, Audi's undoubted expertise in hybrid tech and robotic driving systems being available to others.
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MCDK
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Post by MCDK »

happy days wrote: Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:43 pm
CharlesElliott wrote: Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:59 am

At a public charger. People don't have petrol stations at home.

Charles

Imagine the fun drunks and small children are going to have unplugging them all... plus imagine the compo claims that will ensue from 'careful' people tripping over all those wires which were just left lying around! Plus I suspect charge rage could be a factor when some people hog the public stands or leave their cars unattended for hours and hours while there is a queue to get to them. A bit like the queue at the petrol station when some people park at the pumps and go in for a full week's shopping or a sit down meal!
Tesla are working on the problem of people staying too long. Watched a programme on it, given their cars will self drive they simply drive away when charged and park themselves somewhere else until the owner calls it back to where he parked it. Might work on a £100k Tesla but can't see Toyota and Nissan getting the tech on a Yaris or Leaf!!
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goron59
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Post by goron59 »

Tesla are also considering fining/charging people who leave their cars plugged in for more than a few mins past the full charge. Maybe they're already doing it.
Basically they realise that Tesla drivers are already inconsiderate arseholes.
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MCDK
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Post by MCDK »

I think most EV drivers are guilty of over staying at charge points. If they are away doing shopping or having a meal they will return when they are ready irrespective of how long before that the car was fully charged. This is the one huge flaw with public charge points and maybe significant fines are the way to go. Still not great even for a considerate owner who needs to keep checking via an app when the car is charged and leave mid dinner to move it.
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goron59
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Post by goron59 »

MCDK wrote: Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:04 am I think most EV drivers are guilty of over staying at charge points. If they are away doing shopping or having a meal they will return when they are ready irrespective of how long before that the car was fully charged. This is the one huge flaw with public charge points ...
Maybe, but the supermarket carparks around me have charge points in as many as 1/5 of the available parking spots, and never all fillled. They're not brand-limited either. A glimpse of the near future.

I'm not sure how much juice you'd get during a 20min shop though.
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wilko
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Post by wilko »

I have 2 employees who've changed to plug in hybrids as company cars in the last couple of years, purely for their BIK savings. I've installed three 7kw charge points on our 2 sites and it's surprising how many visitors now hook up while in meetings with us.
The 2 hybrids on the fleet start every journey with a full charge, and take 1-2 hours to reach full charge, but neither user finds this arduous.

I regularly drive 7-800 miles over 2 days into europe, and if I could get a full charge in 50 mins and get 2-300 miles, it wouldn't be a real hardship. Traveling a lot in holland and Belgium, my sat nav appears to have as many charging stations as petrol stations shown.

The public infrastructure will spring up remarkably quickly as more plug in are sold. There is the issue with the power generation, but the majority of charging will still take place overnight, when there is a significant excess.

The whole environmental argument is entirely different, but legislation will push us down this route.

As for people not having charging stations at home, I have a thirsty car, and do double the average mileage, but fill up on average 5 times a month, each time wasting 10 mins, so to have to plug in at home 3 times a month overnight, and 2times at a services, or supermarket, losing 50 mins or less a time is no hardship.

Also, if they have no off street parking, anything that makes parking for people without drives or garages is a win in my book. I'd change the law and not allow people to have more vehicles than they can comfortably park either of road, or directly in front of their house. I accept my chances in politics are slim, and I'd be unlikely to accept the pay cut.
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happy days
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Post by happy days »

The big issue for me is still how the government will tax EVs. They simply cannot afford to lose fossil fuel tax revenue. When they start to screw EV drivers, it will get interesting.
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