Porsche Fires Up Production of eFuel, Made from Water in Chile

[GTB]

Good detail there wilco,

Yes larger vehicles can and are moving to Hydrogen, because they can afford the plant required and/or storage required plus competent people to fill up the vehicles. The main gas distribution grid is looking at putting in a small % of hydrogen to the 100% methane natural gas we have at the moment but as you state Hydrogen has a lower energy, so you need to burn more if you want to have like for like. Also the national gas grid already leaks in places, and Hydrogen atoms being so small will leak from anything that isnt really a welded joint/connection. Another downside because Hydrogen only needs approx 19 Micro Joules of energy to ignite it, any Hydrogen leaking out a pipe will self ignite so thats another negative for it in a public setting. Politicians thinking we can all replace our traditional methane gas boilers with Hydrogen ones are living in a fantasy world.

As some of us have been stating on here, there will be a mix of automotive fuels, and Hydrogen along with Electric vehicles will be two of them, but having politicians make the decisions based on engineering facts just doesnt happen, they want the climate change net zero headline for the day, make unbelievable bold statements of deadlines for this and that. Simply cant be achieved in majority of cases.

300 Million ICE vehicles just in North America, but thats not counting generators, boats, outboard engines and all the other uses for ICE.

Scientists, can do the theory and prove a concept works, I have no issuues with that, but engineers need to scale it up, but it also needs to be commercially viable and for investors/companies to make a return, also Joe Public needs to be able to afford it.

GTB

[Jon A]

…so looking at it across a slightly longer time frame (and bringing this back to cars in particular), I think the ultimate goal is to have a national grid served by exclusively renewable and nuclear energy. This would mean that BEV’s are entirely viable, particularly as battery technology improves.
I think BMW are already making batteries without the rare earth metals and this kind of development will only continue.
I accept ships, planes and a host of other things will require combustible fuel but maybe that’s where efuels come into their own - just don’t see us moving in this direction for personal transport when BEV is already viable and things like range and infrastructure is minor detail in the bigger picture.

[Pivot]

We are still at early stage of alt energy. Dreaming for a moment…

I see us using personal aircraft like Tom Cruise had in Oblivion (movie) with such batt-packs that last for days of continuous use. For that we need to solve nuke/fusion tech that is safe and abundant. It’s an engineering problem and will be solved!

In the meantime, let’s ride the flat-6-boxer

[wilko]

…so looking at it across a slightly longer time frame (and bringing this back to cars in particular), I think the ultimate goal is to have a national grid served by exclusively renewable and nuclear energy. This would mean that BEV’s are entirely viable, particularly as battery technology improves.
I think BMW are already making batteries without the rare earth metals and this kind of development will only continue.
I accept ships, planes and a host of other things will require combustible fuel but maybe that’s where efuels come into their own - just don’t see us moving in this direction for personal transport when BEV is already viable and things like range and infrastructure is minor detail in the bigger picture.

Er No!
Energy demand varies, and so does renewable generation, particularly wind and solar. Nuclear is fixed, as in can’t be varied at any rate that maters, so you need something to do the 10+ GW of hour by hour variation. Some days wind does nearly 20GW, other days nearly zero.
We have a demand of 30-40GW and the mix goes from gas being 2GW to 30GW, as it can be adjusted quickly.
This is why methane from excess renewable energy, (so quadruple current wind and solar) can be used to generate methane from co2 and water, and can be stored in our current storage and distribution.
Just to remind you again. Batteries are really bad. BEV’s are really bad. Small engine (1.0l 90hp) hybrids with a decent electric range of 50miles plus are good, if we have a power grid using renewable energy, with methane generated from excess renewable energy taking up the slack.

[Jon A]

…so looking at it across a slightly longer time frame (and bringing this back to cars in particular), I think the ultimate goal is to have a national grid served by exclusively renewable and nuclear energy. This would mean that BEV’s are entirely viable, particularly as battery technology improves.
I think BMW are already making batteries without the rare earth metals and this kind of development will only continue.
I accept ships, planes and a host of other things will require combustible fuel but maybe that’s where efuels come into their own - just don’t see us moving in this direction for personal transport when BEV is already viable and things like range and infrastructure is minor detail in the bigger picture.

Er No!
Energy demand varies, and so does renewable generation, particularly wind and solar. Nuclear is fixed, as in can’t be varied at any rate that maters, so you need something to do the 10+ GW of hour by hour variation. Some days wind does nearly 20GW, other days nearly zero.
We have a demand of 30-40GW and the mix goes from gas being 2GW to 30GW, as it can be adjusted quickly.
This is why methane from excess renewable energy, (so quadruple current wind and solar) can be used to generate methane from co2 and water, and can be stored in our current storage and distribution.
Just to remind you again. Batteries are really bad. BEV’s are really bad. Small engine (1.0l 90hp) hybrids with a decent electric range of 50miles plus are good, if we have a power grid using renewable energy, with methane generated from excess renewable energy taking up the slack.

Sorry, disagree. My son works for RR Nuclear and a lot of what you say there isn’t quite accurate. There is also much work being done on tidal generation which can be switched on or off or even reduced as required.
Too big a subject for a forum so we will agree to disagree and I wish you a very merry Xmas

[wilko]

That’s fine Jon, but tidal currently makes up around zero percent of our generation, and nuclear is flatlined at 6GW, so I’ll be dead before it can do anything useful to work with our varying demand.
Just for reference one of my siblings is on the board of the largest power company in North America, and she pretty much agrees with me on all of this.
There is probably things we can do that will come out in the next 30 years, or after I’m dead, that will help to generate energy at the variable rate we use it, in a carbon neutral way, but when we have the ability to generate methane, or E fuels, that use current technology and provide a completely carbon neutral way foreword, why wouldn’t we?

[wilko]

Sorry forgot to say. Merry Christmas.

[Col Lamb]

We are still at early stage of alt energy. Dreaming for a moment…

I see us using personal aircraft like Tom Cruise had in Oblivion (movie) with such batt-packs that last for days of continuous use. For that we need to solve nuke/fusion tech that is safe and abundant. It’s an engineering problem and will be solved!

In the meantime, let’s ride the flat-6-boxer

You cannot be serious!

Personal aircraft … I had two near misses whilst piloting a Piper light aircraft due to other pilots not observing others, with a closing speed of 250 mph one needs the eyes of a hawk and observation skills to match.

Hundreds of commuters all going into their respective towns to work or heaven for bid, 500 Mums all flying to school to drop off or pick them up kids, it would be impossible to manage safely.

You also most definitely would not want to be flying in a light aircraft in turbulence, so bad ones eyeballs rattle so bad you cannot see the instruments and that other aircraft you see looks like a 1000 bomber raid.

[Jon A]

We are still at early stage of alt energy. Dreaming for a moment…

I see us using personal aircraft like Tom Cruise had in Oblivion (movie) with such batt-packs that last for days of continuous use. For that we need to solve nuke/fusion tech that is safe and abundant. It’s an engineering problem and will be solved!

In the meantime, let’s ride the flat-6-boxer

You cannot be serious!

Personal aircraft … I had two near misses whilst piloting a Piper light aircraft due to other pilots not observing others, with a closing speed of 250 mph one needs the eyes of a hawk and observation skills to match.

Hundreds of commuters all going into their respective towns to work or heaven for bid, 500 Mums all flying to school to drop off or pick them up kids, it would be impossible to manage safely.

You also most definitely would not want to be flying in a light aircraft in turbulence, so bad ones eyeballs rattle so bad you cannot see the instruments and that other aircraft you see looks like a 1000 bomber raid.

I think Pivot was being tongue in cheek Col…

[Pivot]

We are still at early stage of alt energy. Dreaming for a moment…

I see us using personal aircraft like Tom Cruise had in Oblivion (movie) with such batt-packs that last for days of continuous use. For that we need to solve nuke/fusion tech that is safe and abundant. It’s an engineering problem and will be solved!

In the meantime, let’s ride the flat-6-boxer

You cannot be serious!

Personal aircraft … I had two near misses whilst piloting a Piper light aircraft due to other pilots not observing others, with a closing speed of 250 mph one needs the eyes of a hawk and observation skills to match.

Hundreds of commuters all going into their respective towns to work or heaven for bid, 500 Mums all flying to school to drop off or pick them up kids, it would be impossible to manage safely.

You also most definitely would not want to be flying in a light aircraft in turbulence, so bad ones eyeballs rattle so bad you cannot see the instruments and that other aircraft you see looks like a 1000 bomber raid.

I think Pivot was being tongue in cheek Col…